Public Menace #2: Stephen Wacker Shares Ultimate Spider-Man: Web Warriors Clip & Explains Its Connection To Spider-Verse

Stephen Wacker can’t stop beating up Spider-Man.

He loves the guy, really, but Wacker knows that only the best Spider-Man stories happen when Peter Parker is put through the proverbial wringer. He has to make personal sacrifices, and then some, in order to be the iconic hero all audiences can connect to. In Wacker’s mind, it’s what makes Spider-Man tick. 

Wacker, who oversees the web head as Vice President of of Current Animation on Disney XD’s Ultimate Spider-Man, carries a burden of great power and responsibility not unlike Peter Parker’s. It’s his job at Marvel Animation to ensure that Ultimate Spider-Man: Web Warriors honors the  character’s core while appealing also appealing to a general audience. And that means he must bite his tongue, give up what he wants the most—to see Peter truly happy— and forbid the character from ever truly escaping the gauntlet. 

After spending years as Spider-Man’s head editor from 2008 to late 2014, Wacker was tapped by Disney Animation to utilize his knowledge and compassion for an entirely different medium. A year into the job, Wacker’s realized that TV may be a different ballgame from comics, but the same rules for a good Spider-Man story still apply. 

In an exclusive interview for Public Menace, Wacker opened up about his job at Marvel Animation, how Amazing Spider-Man’s recently-wrapped Spider-Verse storyline morphed into Disney XD’s Ultimate Spider-Man: Web Warriors, and what makes for an honest Spider-Man story, regardless of its target audience and medium.

As a bonus, we have an exclusive preview clip of tonight’s Ultimate Spider-Man: Web Warriors episode below. 

And in case you missed it, check out Public Menace’s two-part interview with Wacker’s successor, Senior Editor Nick Lowe, here and here. 

So what are you daily duties on Ultimate Spider-Man: Web Warriors? How do you help guide the show from the writer’s room to what viewers see on-air?

I’ll start in the past. Ultimate Spider-Man was my entryway into animation. During the first season, Jeph Loeb started asking me to come out to Los Angeles every three or four months to sit in the writer’s room with all the guys responsible for getting the show off of the ground. I was just there to be a voice in the room, since I had context for what was happening in the comics. That then morphed into a new job where I would come over here full time, and be the person in-charge of running the current series, which is the series currently on-air, not in development. So for all of the shows, it’s my responsibility to get the writers together, work with production to get the stories up on the screen while guarding each character’s history, and work with the other parts of Disney to get the resources that we need. I keep the show creatively on track. 

What’s the biggest difference between working on Spider-Man in comic books and in television? How has your experience as a comics editor guided your experience in animation?

I think the biggest difference, and one that I still sort of crash up against once in a while, the sheer speed that we can do something in comic books. If I wanted to do something with Amazing Spider-Man writer Dan Slott, we could have a discussion and get it in print within the next handful of months. I could even add or tweak a line of dialogue the day a book was going to print. With animation, it just takes a long time. You’re working way ahead of schedule. These shows that are airing, we started working on them two-to-two and a half years ago with the writers and executives. So, this has been in the process for a long time, back to the point where Dan Slott first came up with the idea for Spider-Verse. So I’m struck by the speed in which you can affect things. In film, or animation, once a picture is locked or dialogue is locked, you can edit it. It’s very difficult to go back in and change anything, as opposed to comics, where you can have something drawn or written that day. 

You mentioned that Web Warriors has been in the works for more than two years. Obviously, it’s very similar to what just finished in the comics’ Spider-Verse event, which you must have started before moving to Marvel Animation. Were Spider-verse and Web Warriors always planned to debut around the same time? How did the two projects come about?

I’ll go back to the beginning. When Dan first came up with the Spider-Verse idea, it was going to the final arc for is Superior Spider-Man series.  He brought that to one of the Marvel publishing summits, and pitched it a couple of times, but no one blinked an eye. Then at one of the summits when we were closer to Superior Spider-Man’s end, once they realized “Spider-Verse” marked the end of Superior’s story, there was a real movement to move it out of Superior Spider-Man and wait until Peter Parker was back. We wanted him to be a part of that story. So after Dan pitched Spider-Verse, everyone loved it so much, they wanted it to feature the real Spider-Man, Peter Parker. 

Then the story stuck on Joe Quesada’s mind. As our chief creative officer, he’s at every publishing, TV, and film summit. So, at one of the Spidey animation summits, he suggested that we do a version of Spider-Verse with Ultimate Spider-Man: Web Warriors. So he’s the one who had the idea of bringing it over to animation.  At that point, the publishing story was going to come out long before the animated version, since it was going to be in Superior Spider-Man. But that all changed, and it’s odd now that these two stories are coming out so close to each other. The original plan was to have the publishing story come out way beforehand. But, now it makes for a nice synchronous release. Web Warriors took the basic idea, but it goes off in a very different direction with different motivations. But the high concept of it all still remains the same. It’s an army of different versions of Spider-Man. We see Peter Parker meet characters like Spider-Man 2099, Miles Morales, an all-new Spider-Girl, Spider-Ham, and Spider-Knight. It’s all different versions of Spider-Man that Peter gets to interact with, which the publishing and animation bleed into. But it all started with Dan Slott’s original idea. 

And now that you’ve worked in the publishing and animation departments, you’ve experienced the creative process from both sides of the fence. How has animations interaction with publishing changed, since you’ve been on their side?

I think it helps that I know the players involved. I know where to find Nick Lowe when he’s not in the office, or any of the editors working the scene. But I think the relationship is growing more and more. Spider-Verse was the first step, and I think as we get deeper into Avengers, you’ll see how we’re playing off of the actual comics’ history. We’ve even had Mark Waid  and Tom Brevoort out for a couple of summits. I think with the new Guardians of the Galaxy series we’re working on, we’re working more closely than ever to publish original Guardians comics set in the animated series’ universe. These wont be adaptations of the cartoon. So I hope the relationship is closer than it’s ever been. 

I think the world of comics has changed, in that where comics used to be the entry point for some kids into our characters, the movies and animated television have do that instead. You start with the animation and graduate into the comics, which have always skewed a little older. Going back to when Stan ran the company, comics have always been a little darker. But now we can bring them into the Marvel Universe through a clean channel. 

And speaking of introducing new readers to new material, the Spider-Man line has recently introduced several new characters to its fold, including Spider-Gwen, Superior Spider-Man, and Spider-Gwen. If a story or opportunity ever came up, would you try to include those characters on Ultimate Spider-Man?

Totally. Again, remembering that it takes us a couple of years to get something out, if you look back to previous few years of Spider-Man, from publishing, you’ll see some of those things in the animated world. And going forward, characters like Spider-Gwen and Silk certainly have a place near and dear to my heart, so I’d like to see them on the show. But it all takes some time, and we want to get it right. 

What has working on Spider-Man as a cartoon character taught you Spider-Man? What new ideas or wrinkles in the Spider-Man mythology have you realized since working on him as a comic book character?

From the beginning, Ultimate Spider-Man’s high concept has been how Peter Parker operates on a team. And I’m still of a mind where Spider-Man’s a solo character. That’s just what I’ve grown up with and what I know. Even after Spider-Man’s been on the Avengers for more than 10 years, I’ve gotten used to the fact that he’s a good team member. But seeing him in a position where even though he’s the same age as a bunch of our characters, but he’s had much more experience as a hero. I like our Spider-Man to still act like a teen, and not over-competent like Captain America. I like that he’s a regular guy, he has his own insecurities, but he doesn’t understand that the other heroes look up to him. I think that’s a very kid-friendly idea, and maybe that’s an adult friendly-idea too: We only have our own perspectives of ourselves, we don’t see ourselves through other people’s eyes. I think that’s one aspect in season one, and particularly in season three, with our new story editors Henry Gilroy and Eugene Son, that the show has picked up a lot—how the other heroes treat him. It’s an aspect of the show that I like a lot.

In your opinion, what does every Spider-Man story need to be universally appealing to all audiences, whether it’s a children’s cartoon or a “serious” comics story?

I like the idea that in any given Spider-Man story, the cost of being of being Spider-Man comes at the expense of his personal life. Every time he puts that costume on, there’s something he’s sacrificing in his personal life. He has to come to terms with that whether it’s with a relationship or a loved one, or a job. There’s always some thing he’ll never be ale to do as Peter Parker. He’s never able to fulfill his life as Peter Parker because of what he has to do as Spider-Man. 

It doesn’t always have to be as heavy as somebody dying, but it’s always really hard for him to make the decision. But ultimately he does it, because that was his spark of creation. With great power comes great responsibility. I think the best Spider-Man stories, all of them that I’m thinking of, have that element of “there’s a cost to putting on that costume.” Spider-Man was the first superhero you ever saw that with. When he was created in 1962, that was not a common thing. Being Superman didn’t come at a cost that was anything relatable. You could argue that being Spider-Man has ruined this kid’s life. He struggles finding happiness, or any sort of life because being Spider-Man always interferes. I think that’s true in the cartoons, across the films, and certainly in the comics.

And what do you think, personally,  is the most appealing aspect of Spider-Man? What keeps you interested in the character after living and breathing him for seven years?

 I guess it’s just the nature of what we do. I don’t know how this guy’s story ends. Emotionally, you want this guy to find happiness. You’re rooting for Peter Parker, or any of the Spider-Men like Miles Morales. You want them to have happy ends. But I know, since I’m working backstage here at the magic show, that closing this guy’s story is the last thing we want. But, if you’re doing this the right way, as a writer, animator, or anyone else behind the desk, you’re making it impossible for Peter to find happiness. It’s hard to do, because after a while, the characters do start to feel real to you. Particularly, the Marvel characters will do that to you. I know outside of a “What-If” story, this guy is never going to find happiness. If I’m reading a story where everything’s going great for Peter, I know I’m being set up. But, that’s also why you’re in for the ride. You want to see what people come up with to complicate this character’s life. I think from a creative standpoint, you are excited to pull the rug out from under the readers. You want to give them a false sense of  security, because it’s our job to play with emotions. We want to play with expectations. 

Awesome. So to wrap up, you’ve been in this position for just over a year now. In that time, what have been some of the pleasant surprises of working in animation? And conversely,  what do you miss the most from working in comics?

With this job, I’m really responsible for the writing. Our head of production, Eric Radomski, deals with animation, so it’s been a real seat-change for me to not talk to artists every day and bounce ideas off of them. We talk about Dan Slott a lot, but on Amazing Spider-Man, artists like Humberto Ramos, Giuseppe Camuncoli, and Marcos Martin—that group of people added a lot to the stories. So that’s been a real change for me. I miss that part of it. But that time has been filled up  with challenges like trying to get a complete episode with as much drama as six comics into a twenty-two minute episode of television. As much as it seems like any show has an unlimited budget, you have to spend your money wisely. That’s different than comic books. The visuals come at a cost here in a way that they don’t in comics. 

Understandable. So, I have to ask, who would you cast as the new Spider-Man for the upcoming Spider-Man reboot?

I think there’s really only one choice, in my mind. I don’t think I need to remind the comicbook.com audience that I was an extra in the film American President back in 1995. And I think there’s very little reason why I shouldn’t be considered. In fact, I auditioned for a role in The Spider-Man Broadway Musical. I think there’s a video of me auditioning for Turn Off The Dark that marvel.com never showed. 

Stephen Wacker for Spidey.

(laughs) I love it. Though that’d be the worst hashtag ever.

That wraps it up for me, Steve. Thanks for taking the time to talk.